Expo Zaragoza 2008 :: News

Eduardo Mestre: "The water reserve is not going to withstand the judgement of History"

The new director of the Water Platform, Eduardo Mestre, as an expert, proves to be very critical with topics such as water transfers or the water reserve, with respect to which he ensures that “it will not withstand the judgement of History”.  On the contrary, Mestre believes in water management based on a new culture with a more social approach.

The Water Platform is the third pillar that supports Expo Zaragoza 2008, together with the exhibitions and shows.  Its role is to become the ideologists of the international show and develop a worldwide debate on water and sustainable development.  This task has recently fallen upon the shoulders of Eduardo Mestre, a specialist in hydraulic matters who has been involved in water basin management for many years and who has recently collaborated in management projects of different countries such as Nicaragua, South Africa or Nepal.  He has also worked for organisations such as the World Bank or the European Union.

QUESTION.- The Water Platform wants to bring out a document that will include the will of the countries participating in the Expo regarding a new water vision: The Zaragoza Charter.  What difference will there be between the Zaragoza Charter and other international documents such as Johannesburg and Kyoto, which are not worth the paper they are written on?
ANSWER.- When commitments were established, in the case of Johannesburg and Kyoto, these commitments were made in such a way that, either the interests or the thresholds to satisfy the goals were so high that finally they fell through.  We do not want the Zaragoza Charter to just be a salute to the flag.  We need it to be a worldwide reference.

The will for change expressed in the cases of Kyoto and Johannesburg is quite praiseworthy, but the level of their commitments has caused much frustration, irritation and loss of hope in those of us who have the ability to turn around this situation.  In the case of the Zaragoza Charter, firstly we are going to look for the will and then the commitments will gradually fall into place.

Q.- How are you going to turn it into a reference document on a worldwide level?
A.- One reason for it being a reference on a worldwide level is that no agreements have been reached in any of the charters that have existed on water over the last eight or ten years, and every time an attempt has been made to sign an epistle of this kind, it has failed.  We must try to do things differently, and the difference lies in a change in direction, working towards a different modality.  Social and humanistic type work has never been included in this type of documents and if it is not done properly, the proposal of the forum will become just another conference proposal.  We want to create a lively and very strong debate, with a different focus, which puts the typical scientist, who wants to say his bit over and over again, off-balance.  The social and economic viewpoints are the major aspects to be dealt with.

Q. Can you advance some of the contents of the Zaragoza Charter?
A.- More than 10,000 children die in the world each day due to illnesses related to access to water, but you must not expect the Zaragoza Charter to offer a figure regarding how many more children will have water in Africa.  That is not our aim.  That is not the job of Expo Zaragoza.  The idea is for children coming here to get a different idea of water.  However, one of the points of the Zaragoza Charter will refer to clean, safe water.  There will also be a point referring to water and its relationship with energy, as nowadays these two elements go hand in hand.  The "developed western" world will have desalination plants while the situation will be very different in the underdeveloped world where there is a shortage of water; we will see how poor people can have water.

Q.- What is your opinion of contamination taxes?
A.- The taxes that are being paid today in France, Mexico or Brazil are taxes that have been wrongly applied, as what they are doing is to give permission to contaminate.  A completely different path must be taken; we must see how we can reward anyone that has a zero dumping policy.  Furthermore, we must involve all the social agents in this fight; it is not enough for the State to clean the water.  In this way we are all paying for a few.  Let’s give an example:  Setting up an industry that creates 2000 jobs in a certain place is not necessarily a good thing, it must be contrasted.  We, as a universal community, must carry out a simple financial analysis that may tell us that it works out more expensive to repair the damage than what is produced at the plant.  The associated cost is infinitely greater than everything we have produced.

Q.- During the latest flooding, a series of voices were heard that criticised the “waste” of water that has gone to the sea.  What is your opinion in this regard?
A.- Those voices have not seen what happens to the planet if the water does not reach the sea.  When the water flow is cut off, that part of the sea is going to die and that is a bad thing because, as occurs in some fine tissues of the human being, the cell next to it dies too, and so on and so forth.  Let’s not create necrosis in our sea.  This does not mean that we must not do anything with it, either.  Equilibrium is the solution to all our problems.  We must give nature the chance to heal its wounds.

Q.- Is water a limited asset?
A.- No, there is no water shortage.  Shortage is a topic that involves technology, culture and acceptance of the administration of a public asset.  Let’s give another example:  In the city of Los Angeles the use per capita is 400 litres a day.  Compared with this, in Zaragoza, with a very similar water use, the consumption of water is around 100 litres per inhabitant per day.  Over the last decade and a half in Zaragoza, the reaction has had nothing to do with the water, but with culture, which I believe is a beautiful thing.  The fact that there are now 50,000 people committed to good practices is unprecedented.  It is an extremely interesting civic and cultural movement and it is really worth highlighting; seeing how human beings can react in this manner makes one very happy.

Q.- How has water management evolved?
A.- Water management began as a more finished task following the industrial revolution, because water and society had to be administered in a much more structured fashion.  Then, the need arose for a process that would bring together a series of very important elements such as culture, economic processes, institutions, knowledge and beliefs.  Part of water management is water governability; water management has become much more complicated.  In societies, such as the Spanish society, concessions have had to be made, as a legal figure, with a very formal relationship between the State and a town.  Today water management is looked upon from the political, legal and administrative perspectives, but we have forgotten that we are dealing with a living being.

Q.- How does the water reserve of the Statute of the Autonomy of Aragon fit into water management?
A.- The water reserve, in the medium and long term, is not going to be able to withstand the judgement of History, because we must return to the principles that water management involves the interest of the majority groups.  Coherent solutions must be found for the minority groups, but we cannot work for them.  In the short term, the water reserve is pursuant to the Law.  But I would make a call to reconsider, at some point, reviewing the origin, the reasons and the consequences of the water reserve, examining how we can respond to the interest of all parties.  The State controls the water resources, and we must build on that foundation.

Q.- In the European case, some water-related matters have become the competence of the European Union, as is the case of the Framework Directive.
A.- The Framework Directive has some visions where the most avant-garde European enlightened thinking is concentrated, to improve the relationship of man and societies with water.  Today water has become an urban element, which leads us to the need to change the relationship with water and, probably, directives such as the Framework Directive are going to guide us towards those principles.  They are challenges but “we must change or die”.

Q.- Does this include the current institutions that control water management?
A.- Criteria must prevail that go beyond the structures that are starting to look their age today, that feel their age, such as the structure of the Water Basin Authorities or the structure of the Water Agencies.  In the Spanish case, the oldest of them all, the Confederación Hidrográfica del Ebro (Ebro Water Basin Authority), has been a magnificent institution, but it must gradually adapt, not to a change in rhetoric, but to a different world.  The economy today is not an agricultural one, although this is still very important; we are no longer undergoing the transition from a rural to an urban Spain.  We now have a different Spain, immersed in a different world where the water goes on products other than industry and services.